Lori Givens oral history - November 16, 2023

I'm Leila Soleimany, and I'm interviewing Lori Givens for the Inclusive History and Images Project, a project that seeks to recover the histories of the diverse members of the LMU family.

We are on LMU campus in the Creative Spaces Studios, and today is November 16th, 2023. Do you give me permission to interview you for the Inclusive History and Images Project, and do you allow the

recording to be used in accordance with the stated goals of the project? I do. Okay.

What is your name now and what was your name when you were at LMU? Same name, has not changed. Lori Givens. Okay, and when and where were you born?

Los Angeles, California. Uh, the year? 1979. Okay. Where is your hometown or the area in which you

grew up? Hometown is Los Angeles. Um went to school in Manhattan Beach. Um I grew up in Los Angeles.

And where do you currently live? Los Angeles. What is your current occupation? I am an assistant principal for a middle school.

Okay. How do you identify yourself? Christian. African American.

Um. Daughter, sister, friend,

mentor, educator. Okay and gender wise? She-her.

So— —female. How did you learn about IHIP, the Inclusive History and Images Project?

I received an email from Joseph a few months ago, um, describing the project, um, and providing linked information, um, as it pertains to the purpose of the project. I read through it, um, and responded accordingly.

So what made you want to take part in this project? I had an amazing experience while being a student here at LMU, and to be able to share that experience,

um, to be able to, um, have voice and presence, um, in what I experienced while here, um, and to potentially share that with incoming students, new students, um, current students.

Um, I think it's really important, and I think it's important for other African American students to see those of us that have attended and have gone through, um, some of the experiences that we've had here and to be

able to identify, um, and it sort of makes it possible, you know, it makes what may be unrealistic for some, a reality when they see someone who looks like and or identifies, um, with their experience.

So I was excited. Thank you for joining us. Um, what years did you attend LMU? I completed my undergraduate, uh, 1996 through 2000, and then

I returned in 2001, January—Spring of 2001 to complete my graduate. And I graduated in 2003. Okay.

And what made you really want to return when you had that option? So it was the—it was the relationships. I went to,

um—I graduated with my undergrad, I started grad school at USC. And I didn't like it. It was too big.

Um it was—it was—it was a lot different. Um I had professors who identified with us, like, by our Social Security—by the last four digits of our social or ID number,

right? Or I had some professors who I never met with a professor, like I would only meet with the TA [Teacher’s Assistant], and it was just a much different experience than I

had here at LMU. And so although my grad school tuition was paid for, um, by the university, I made a decision to come back to LMU.

And I remember at that time, um, I had a conversation with Edmundo Litton in the School of Education. He was a teacher at the time—a professor at the time.

And I said, Doctor Litton, I want to come back. And he's like, Come, you know. And so I applied, and I was here, like, the very next month, ready to start spring semester for the

School of Ed. So would you say that you had built more authentic relationships— —definitely [Crosstalk] with faculty here?

Okay. Okay. With faculty, with staff. Most definitely.

Okay. What was your major and minor? My major was English. I didn't have a minor.

Um, I was an English major with an emphasis in writing. Um. And needless to say, I switched majors like—

four or five times, like, while I was here. I started off as an art history major, and then I went to communications, and then I did liberal studies,

and—so it was four times, and then I did English. So I switched four times and graduated in four years. [Laughs.] Okay.

So how did you decide on those— on that major I would say, is your final, This is the one? Um. At some point while I was here—it had

to have been my sophomore year. Um we had to do a—like, a community service project. It was—it was actually called an intercultural affairs project.

The intercultural affairs office was brand new. Um it was led—the director at the time, his name was Henry Ward. Um it was the new buzz word—buzz term, um,

of the time. And so—at any rate—and part of being a part of the intercultural affairs classes, we had to do this project, and our project was to go into the

community and work. And so a group of students and I—it was four of us— we went to Westchester High School.

That was our project. And we were, um— We were tasked with helping the school, and so the school was basically able to put us wherever they wanted

us to be. And so they put me in a classroom. Um and when I began to see the needs of the kids at that school, um, and—

we began to talk with them and understand like what they want, their desires, what their goals are. Um and to know that it extended far beyond, like, what they had available to them.

And they needed resources and supports far beyond what was available for them. I decided at that point to become a teacher. And so,

um, I had to choose, What would I love to teach? And so because I loved writing, um, I was like, Oh, I'll teach English.

And so I knew that I was a very strong writer, um, and that I had a love for writing. And I hoped that I would be able to, like, instill that in the kids that I worked with.

Um, so that's kinda-sorta where it started. Oh, okay. So basically led you to your career, you would say?

It did. Okay. Uh why did you decide to come to LMU in the first place? I didn't. So—so I stumbled upon LMU. Um, I was in high school, and honestly, I didn't

want to go to class this particular day. And, uh, I had friends, they were like, We're going on a field trip. And I was like, Where are you going?

And they said, We're going on a college tour. And I was like, Oh, I want to go. And so I went to the college counselor and I said, I want to go on the field trip today.

And she's like, Well, your mom has to give permission. And so I was like, That's a no brainer. Like, of course my mom's going to give me permission, right, to go on a college tour at the last

minute. Got permission. I walked on—we—we—we took the bus. And at the time, the flagpoles were like, that was

the entrance and exit. Right there was there was not an LMU drive, so it was all 80th Street. We get off the bus and we're walking down,

we're walking—by the flagpoles and we're coming down the main, um—the main pathway. And I get in front of Seaver, right? And I was like,

I could be here. And it was just, like, a feeling, like it was one of those, like, gut feelings, This is home.

Um I never thought that that was, like, a real feeling until I actually felt it. And I felt that in that moment and I was like, I could be here.

Like I could see myself as a student here and I literally, like, saw myself walking around campus and like, you know, Foley Ponds and like, I saw the whole scene,

right? And it wasn't until then that I said, I want to go there. And then, I applied,

and had to fight my way in, because I didn't have, um—I didn't have the grade point average to be here. Um and so—but I just kind of knew, like

that—that trip for me, in which I thought it was just going to be time away from school, like, you know— you don't have to go to class today,

just go do something, get away—ended up being the start of a totally different life for me. Wow.

Okay. So were you the first in your family to go to university? Yes, I was. My—my parents went to community college, uh,

married young, and then my aunt—my mom's sister—she went to college, but she was in, like, her 30s. So she had been in the workforce for a while. So as far as, like, the first to graduate high

school and immediately go to college? Yes. Um, but was I the first to have a degree? No, my—my aunt had graduated from Cal State first.

So LMU’s mission is committed to the encouragement of a learning, the education of the whole person, and to the service of faith and the promotion of justice. How important would you say were these principles to you

before coming to LMU? And I can repeat that if you need me to. Can you repeat that? Yeah.

Um. LMU's mission is committed to the encouragement of learning, the education of the whole person, and to the service of faith and the promotion of justice.

The service of faith was important. Um I don't know if I would classify it as being one of the top priorities in terms of why I made the choice to be here.

Um but— raised in it—you know, in a Christian household, heavily involved in church, um, my entire life—um, being with like-minded individuals

was important to me. I just don't know if I have the capacity to verbalize that at 17. Um, commitment to justice,

now that I look back on it, it was important because it had been a part, like, of my life in terms of, you know, our doing work in the community, both my family and in the schools that I

attended. Um so it wasn't my badge of honor, you know, that I picked up and say, We're going to do this, you know, but when it came time to participate,

when it came time to, um, spearhead or co-lead something, like, I was that person. Um, so in hindsight, were those the driving pillars that brought me here?

Absolutely not. Um but did—did I have the foundation before I came? Yes.

And was that foundation exacerbated as a result of my being here? Most definitely. Okay.

So you would say then the religious aspect—the service of faith aspect of LMU—wasn't entirely, like, the deal for you, it was more just like an addition.

To the campus itself and to everything else that you fell in love with. Because I had been— yes, I would say that—because I had been in—

and maybe it's not fair, right? Because I had been in Catholic school most of my life. And so, um, maybe that was part of the familiarity

of what I felt when I came, in that feeling of being home. Like maybe that was part of why I felt so comfortable, because I had always been in a faith based

space. Um. So as you're asking me the question, like, would I have been able to draw that connection, or did I

draw that connection when I was 17? No. Um but I knew that the feeling that I felt on LMU’s campus was very much different than what I

felt at UC Riverside, which is where I— well, that was like my first choice school, right? Um, it was a—it was very much a different feeling.

And so, it could be all of those things. And a subconscious like, This feels like home, I'm walking into campus and seeing this huge church, and that kind of resonates with my with my personal life,

in some sense. Not so much the physical building of the church, but in how people treat one another.

Right? And so in— in being kind. Um in speaking to one another. In

making sure that the next person was okay. So the measure of accountability that we had for one another, um—and not just in our dorm life, but in

our academic life as well, you know—so, like, it was almost inherent, like, My partner is not here, let me—let me give her the notes, or my partner— or we have a final, let me get an extra

blue book because someone's going to forget. Like it was just an inherent part of what we did and that we took care of one another in that way.

Okay. Okay. Did you sense the importance of these principles during your studies at LMU?

I did. Um I think that— they were the driving force for why we did what we did.

So even the intercultural project—you know, like, going out into the community and serving— right? Um it was the—it was the pillar of LMU's

moniker. I mean, even in my current day cover letter of my—for my resume, Serving with and for others, right?

Like that is what we do. That is the nature of, you know, why we are purposed in the way that we are. And so those were all, um, instilled as a result

of my experiences here. Our professors—at least at the time—our professors, when we got into the classroom, it was—it was a community of people.

It was a—it was a true community of learners, right? And so no one person felt any more or less validated than anyone else.

Um, and no one opinion was valued to a greater degree than anyone else's. And so it was—we used to call it “The Bubble”—LMU was a bubble—and it was not

the real world. Um but I think that the principles that we learned— or that I learned as a student here, shaped and prepared me for the—for the real world out there.

Okay, so you kind of answered my next question, but I want to see if maybe there's anything else you wanted to add. What was LMU like when you were here?

And you know, you can add to some qualities of ”The Bubble,” per se. Um. It was, like, perfection.

I mean, it was—it was like, we had our issues. We had our student issues. Um we, you know,

um, did not always get along as—as student groups. Um but we respected one another, and we found common ground.

So when I served, um, with ASLMU, and I served—when I served on the board, like, there were lots of arguments in those senate meetings, right? There was there were lots of—of disagreements.

Um, and yet when we open the door, you know, of that chamber, we were all speaking the same language of some sort, right?

So we had reached, you know, a level of—of compromise. Um and I think that that filtered its way just into, you know, our social relationships, you know, as well.

So LMU was a community. It was, um— there were—some there was some separation. I don't think—

I think that I was—I had a different experience on some level because, as an African American student, I was not as involved in African American student life. So was I a part of BSU?

Yes. Right? Um did I have an established relationship with Charles Mason? Yes.

Um but was Charles Mason the reason why I was here? No. And so I think that that was a major divide,

because, Mr. Mason, most of the African American students who were at LMU at that time had been recruited by Mr. Mason, like he was very—he was a very strong advocate for African American presence.

Um and he went all over the world, right, recruiting, um, students to become active members, you know, within the LMU community. And so when others would say, you know, like, Oh,

did Mr. Mason recruit you? And I'm like, No, he didn't, you know, it was like, Oh, you know, Well, why, or How did you find out about the school, or How do you know—

like why are you here sort of thing, right? Um so my involvement with student government, I was heavily involved in Student Life because I worked there.

Um I had a work study job. Um so I worked there, and then I was the direct. support for, uh—

I think she was the assistant dean at the time, but Barbara Avery was here. Um, you know, so I had my own separate group of people, that kinda-sorta supported me in

a way. And so I was able—and so because of where I worked, and because of who I worked for, um, and because of a somewhat direct relationship that I had

with Dr. Lane Bove, like, I was able to see things that other students didn't get to see because I was in a different space. Even though I was a student worker, you know?

So when I go back to where I started with LMU was a bubble. You know, there were a group of adults who encap—like they basically encapsulated me and my experience.

And so a lot of my experience was very administrative, adult driven, non-student focused, even though I was a student. So I was doing professional, adult activities and engaged in—

or listening to—adult conversations, and I was a kid. But I was seen—you know what I mean? I was seen, but I didn't— I didn't have a space at the table, to be

able to provide insight or input, but I was able to understand the workings of how administration works. Um, how Student Life works, Student Activities works, the liabilities involved with

student government, you know, Greek organizations, like I was able to see the administrative perspective behind all of these things. So when a student, like my friends would say, They shut down our party in St. Roberts Hall.

Yes, as a student, I'm like, Oh man, like that sucks. But also as a student, I'm—in my head, I'm saying, Well, that was a huge liability because there

was no, you know, event request completed or it wasn't completed accurately. And so if anything were to happen, then we would be responsible as a university for this—

like I understood a different side of it. It was very difficult to bridge that gap when I'm hanging out, you know, in The Lion's Den with my friends, and they're mad because the party got shut down.

So I mean. [Crosstalk] Right. So essentially you played several roles as a student here, um, which leads me to my next question— what was LMU like in terms of academics?

For me academically, um— it wasn't hard. I'm not going to say it was difficult.

I will say, I will take ownership in that I did not apply myself, um, that first year. So it was— yes, you have your adjustment period,

right? But then, you know, I was trying to, like, do my work study job and hang out and I wanted to be with my friends—you know,

so I'm trying to juggle all of these things. Um it wasn't until the spring semester, I think, of my freshman year that I told my roommate at the time—we shared, she was on the other side of

me—and I was like, Megan, I was like, We're going to be on the Dean's List. And she was like, Okay, let's do it.

And so what we would do, um—and we never got caught— but what we would do is we would like go to class all day, right?

And then when it came time to, like, do homework. We play around all evening. So we'd go to dinner, we go to the mall like we'd be all over the city just hanging out.

And then when we would get back to campus at like nine or ten, like I would say, Okay, I'm going to Student Life. Because I work there, I had a [air quotes]key, right?

So I was like, oh, I have access and we will go into the Student Life—the conference room in Student Life—which was on the first floor of Club Commons, in Malone [Student Center].

And we would, like—we started doing our homework, and so we started having, like, full study group sessions at night. And we might get there at like nine, maybe ten,

and we leave at like 1:30, two o’clock in the morning. And— that's how we kind of sort of balanced the, Okay, it's okay to have fun, but we have to get

our work done too. So academically, um, students supported one another, for sure. Um teachers would beg you to come during office hours. I don't think we

ever really wanted to go. Like, we were still at a—I was still at a point where it was weird to be with my

teacher, like outside of class, for like 30 minutes talking about whatever it was that we were talking about. Unless I was getting like direct help, right? Or direct like—here's my essay, like, help me, sort

of thing. Um—but it was always available, you know, and then to be able to see, like, your professor in the cafeteria or your professor in the bookstore, your professor, like,

sitting out in front of Malone on the patio and— you know, and so it became a thing where you walk—you're walking and you're like, you know, like, Hey, Dr. Davis, right?

And then as time progresses, then you become— I don't want to say friends, because I never felt like they were my friends— but you become friendly.

And so then—because you've developed the relationship, you know, so then it becomes easy to go to, you know— Dr. Davis, he was the chair of the African American Studies Department.

So we would go to this office and we just hang out, you know, and we're there, and he's like, Don't y'all have class? And we're like, Nope, we don't, you know, kind of

thing. Um. So academically, I think—again, all of the supports were there.

Um, and. Our Black faculty, um, Dr. Davis, Cheryl Grills.

Uh, Ron— uh, Barnett. Um. They made sure that that we as African American students,

that we were on track, and we were going to graduate. Like that was their mission—even if they didn't say it was their mission out loud— but it was like, what do you need?

What supports do you need? Do you need tutoring? How are your grades? Um so there was that small community, continued check in, where

you had parents, that weren't your parents, that were looking out for you, right? To make sure that you did well, and you represented well.