Fernando Guerra oral history - March 16, 2023

I am Pablo Garcia, and I'm interviewing Dr. Fernando Guerra for the Inclusive History and Images Project, a project which seeks to recover the histories of the diverse members of the LMU family.

We are on the LMU campus in the Creative Spaces Studios and today is Thursday, March 16th, 2023. Do you give permission to interview you for the Inclusive History and Images Project?

Yes, I do. And do you allow the recording to be used in accordance with the stated goals of the project? Yes.

Perfect. So we're going to be starting with the—like just some simple questions. So what is your name?

Fernando Guerra. Fernando Guerra. And when and where were you born? I was born in Los Angeles in 1958, at uh, what

was then General Hospital, and now is known as the USC LA County Hospital, on the Eastside. Eastside. Um, where is your hometown or the area in which

you grew up? I grew up in the area of Highland Park. It's kind of Northeast Los Angeles—you know—where Pasadena, Glendale, and LA meet.

Uh, and right off the 110 Freeway, Pasadena Freeway. Um, where do you currently live? I live in Westchester, about eight blocks from the university.

Uh, what is your current occupation? I'm a professor of Chicana-Chicano, Latina-Latino studies, a professor of political science and international relations, and then the director of the center for the Study of Los Angeles,

all of them here at LMU, obviously. Yeah. Uh, how do you identify yourself? Identify myself as a he-him-his as a Chicano, uh,

Mexican American, uh, depending on the context and the situation, almost any one of these terms that have been used to reference the Mexican origin population um, and uh, obviously also very proudly as an Angeleno.

Mm. Got it. Uh, do you remember how you thought about yourself when you were first hired at LMU? Oh, yeah.

I mean, I thought of myself as a scholar, an activist uh, and Chicano. Perfect. Uh, okay.

And then some questions about the project. Sure. Uh, how did you learn about IHIP, the Inclusive History and Images Project?

Oh, I think I learned about it through uh, some announcements uh, early on when it was starting about. I've learned from it from colleagues discussing—discussion in general, and of course, about all the great photographs that we

see around UHall and other places. I can't remember one specific time when I first heard about it, but it's been so uh, prominent and obvious that uh, it's—

I'm very well aware of it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh, what made you want to take part in this project? Um, you know, uh, agency—always talking about uh, Loyola Marymount University.

And uh, it's so much been part of my professional life that anything to do to help advance the university or talk about the university I'm all in. Perfect.

All right. Okay. So when were you hired here at LMU? I was hired um, interviewed, and made the job offer in

the late spring of 1984. Signed my contract in the summer of '84 and began on August 15th, 1984. Um, when I got my contract,

included in my contract were two tickets to the '84 Olympics for weightlifting. The weightlifting competition was held here at Gersten Pavilion, and so uh, it was the third time that I actually had

visited campus. Uh, I visited campus when I was a high school senior thinking about coming to Loyola Marymount University, and it ended up being one of my final two places that I

was thinking about. I ended up going to USC uh, mostly because they offered me more money. Uh, I had come to LMU to do my faculty interviews,

and then the third time I showed up was to watch the Olympics in Gersten Pavilion. Wow. I didn't know that.

Cool. Uh, what made you decide to join the LMU faculty? Um, well, number one, they uh—I think the mission of the university, I was very well aware of it, having grown

up in LA, was very aware of Loyola Marymount uh—actually, most of the time growing up, it was Loyola University. I was aware of Loyola High School, um, and I thought it would give me the opportunity to uh, pursue my scholarship

and my teaching in a context of social justice. And so—you know—you know, I was very much in favor. Um, I actually didn't think the university would hire me.

I was—at the time that I applied—I was 25 years old. I was still working on my dissertation. I actually I had just started it and um, a uh—my

mentor at the University of Michigan, his best friend was a professor at UCLA. And so in the summer, I uh—late spring at that time—I was already working on my dissertation, so I

was already in LA. He had arranged for me to go and interact with him, and he gave me space at the UCLA library, and I was doing work there and a uh—just a

pure luck—a uh, guy that I knew who was also a graduate student at UCLA in history and was teaching part time at LMU, walked by and said hello. And then I remember him like coming back and says,

"Hey, Fernando, you know LMU is hiring, and they're hiring for position I think you'd be perfect for." And he described it to me. So I made a phone call and they said, "Yeah,

I would like for you to apply." So I applied, submitted my stuff. Uh, then they called me for an interview. And I actually remember I was still living—

I was living at home for those couple of months—uh, getting up that morning and telling my dad, "Oh man, I'm like nervous. You know, I don't even know if I should go.

They're not going to hire me. I'm not doing my dissertation," or whatever. And my dad said, "Hey, you know what? Just go, and think about it,

like when you're in the market the following year or so, you'll have one interview under your belt. You'll know what it's like. And that kind of relaxed me.

So I came, did the interview, and a week later they called me up and said, "Hey, you're hired." Okay. Cool.

Um, and LMU's Mission is committed to the encouragement of learning, the education of the whole person, and to the service of faith in the promotion of justice. Have you sensed the importance of these principles during your

time here at LMU? Absolutely. And uh, it—it is—to me, what has really identified the university, the community, and my experience here.

Um, uh, in retrospect, there's sometimes when I'm like, "Okay, we didn't really uphold that principle." And so the—you know—encouragement of learning when I think about the

First semester that I taught as brand new—you know— assistant professor. I had over 100 students, and that's— and I didn't know any better,

and so I just did it. You know, I enjoyed it. But in retrospect, looking back, that didn't really create the encouragement of learning, etcetera.

You know, uh, but that was just—you know—uh, at that time, every professor was uh—it was in your contract. You had to teach four courses per semester, and the courses tended to be up to 40 students.

So it was theoretically possible for you to have 160 students per semester. And there were times when I had as many and more than 120.

And—but again, not knowing any better, it being my first job. I just thought that's what the norm was and everybody else was doing it, you know?

But when I look back, it's like, "How did we do that? Not only me, but everybody else. How were we able to—you know—accomplish our objectives

in the classroom with so many students?" Uh, here. Uh, what has it been like being a Chicano professor in your time here at LMU?

Um, you know, I think I could answer that question in a variety of different um, levels. Number one, it's been fantastic, in the sense that there were so few of us to begin with.

I saw it as a call to represent, to um, give the perspective of Chicanos, not only, and most importantly to my students, but to my colleagues on the faculty, to the staff, to the administration.

It provided me a platform. It provided me a reason for being to be the Chicano. Um, as a matter of fact, uh, I was—from 1984 probably

until the mid 90s— the only Mexican American male on the faculty. And so I—I was it. And so when people thought about a Chicano professor.

A male Chicano professor. I was that for at least the first decade that I was here. And so I represented all that, even though it's a

case of just one person. And you should never extrapolate from one experience. But I knew that that focus was on me. And so I felt that I had to succeed, be

involved and also assist others when we needed that, especially uh, Chicano—Chicano and Chicana uh, students. So um, it—it was so—it was exhilarating on the one hand, but also exhausting on the other, because if

you wanted to have a Latino or Chicano male on some committee or on some panel or something like that. There was there was one choice.

Yeah. And that was me. And so—you know—now there were a couple of other—quote unquote—Latino males, right?

But they were not of Mexican origin. And to me, it's a distinction given where LMU is in Los Angeles, the Chicano population and the vast majority of our students are—the Latino students—are of Mexican

origin. I know we talk about the diversity within the Latino community. It's very important, very significant, and we've become more diverse

even in that sector. But even to this day, the vast majority of Latino students are of Mexican origin. And when they want to find out about their place

in life, about their future, about how they're going to be impacted, about the obstacles, uh, they need to know that from a—a uh, Mexican origin perspective. And so it's uh, incumbent on uh, us to keep that in

mind, that while we try to be as inclusive as possible in terms of the Latino, Hispanic or Latinx experience, at the core, I'm still very much interested in the Chicano experience.

And I just had a quick follow up question. So because you were the only, like, Chicano, like, faculty staff essentially for like a few—for like a few years.

A male, because there were other—there were—there were several other Latinas. Yeah. Mexican Americans.

Yeah. But how, like, how much pressure do you think that put onto you? Because, I mean, it was back during the 80s and

like I remember back then, it was very, um—it was just very—it was very different times. I mean—you know— in retrospect, I think about it is sometimes it's pressure.

But I people were so supportive during that time and— and—not necessarily a good thing, but tolerant and kind of understood that somebody had to represent—you know—and so I was given leeway to be able to not

only express the perspective of a Chicano, but to push it—you know—and but—you know—always had to be careful, kind of understood that—not to push it too far and—you know—and—and so during, I

would say my first ten years or so, I—it's actually more difficult now—you know—because of um, having been here 38 years, in the first ten years, I still felt about looking at the future, that what I was

doing was going to help change the university, that—that that—we were going to incorporate more Latinos, etcetera. But after 38 years and in some areas, not much

has changed. It's—it's more um—it weighs on me a lot more today, than it did the first ten years of my uh, tenure here.

Wow. Interesting. Um, here. So here.

So you have been at LMU for, like, over 30 years? 38 years? Yeah, 38 years.

They're like nearing 40 years. Wow. Insane. Uh, have you seen LMU make more inclusive changes for its

faculty, staff, and students over the years? Oh, absolutely. I mean, I've seen a tremendous incorporation of women on the faculty, on the staff in administration.

Um, you know, the second most powerful person right now at the university, uh, the CA—the chief administrative officer, is female. Um, you know, half of the president's cabinet is female. All the deans but one are female.

Um, so—you know—when I got here, that just wasn't the case. But um, women have made tremendous gains in representation at every level of the university.

That's number one. Number two, you've seen a tremendous amount of African Americans in uh, decision making positions. You know, uh—you know—right now a senior VP for

Student Affairs is African American. There's a dean who's African American. There were other deans who are African American. The dean of the library in the past was African

American. The—you know—uh, number two person in the provost, the vice provost—you know—so African Americans, proportionately speaking to the

student body population, proportionally to the population of LA, proportionately to the availability of uh— to um, the—the numbers of African Americans in administration. LMU has done well.

We could always do better. And then I could say the same thing about Asian Americans, you know. So it's been again, the provost today is Asian American.

The dean of the science and engineering is Asian American. Um, we've had other Asian Americans in—you know—the I think right now the chief financial officer is Asian American. Right now, I've just described all that tremendous inclusion in

terms of— women, African Americans, and Asians. Nothing for

Latinos. Yeah, yeah. There's not a single Latino in the upper echelons of the administration today in 2023.

Right? And there never has been. Never had a Latino dean. Never had a Latino in the president's cabinet—you know—

never had a Latino as a senior VP. Um, and you take a look at even uh—like Student Affairs, which would be the most inclusive. Even though we have an African-American senior VP, there's not

a single Latino in her leadership team. Um, and then you take a look at other divisions, there are very few Latinos on the leadership team. And so that that is—while inclusion has been tremendous

overall. It's so stark that Latinos have not been part of the inclusion that has occurred at LMU, with the exception of the student body.

I mean—you know—when I got here in 1984, Latino students made up about—you know—12-13% of the student body, and now they're 25-26. So as a percentage, they've doubled.

And then in terms of absolute numbers, they more than quadrupled. And so Loyola Marymount University has done a tremendous job of including, sustaining, and graduating Latino students. But not Latino

administrators. And they've done an okay job—especially recently—especially in the College of Liberal Arts—in including Latino faculty. But when I take a look and say, "Okay,

how is it that Latinos have doubled percentage wise, quadrupled almost in absolute numbers and the student body. And I take a look, what is the specific policies?

What are—there's a few of them. But basically uh, LMU has. Benefited from its location in Los Angeles, in Southern California and the growth of the Latino community in general in

the United States and California, but in particular in Los Angeles County. And they—and they have just naturally gotten those students. In other words, it hasn't been a strategic, proactive inclusion

of Latino students. The demographics alone explain what has happened. Right? But there's still some magic that happens here for Latino

students because of their high graduation rates compared to Latinos elsewhere. So we're doing something right. But even though I've been here for 38 years, even

though I'm a social scientist and study numbers and study patterns, I'd be hard pressed to say what it is that we are strategically doing, that—that what is the magic formula.

And it just could be Jesuit-Marymount education in general, and the environment that we create. And it's that simple. Because, of specific policies,

I find very few that are really attacking that problem of Latino recruitment, Latino retention, and Latino graduation. Interesting. And how do you think—

well, that was the next question I was going to ask, which was pretty interesting because you did mention how it was 24% of, like, the student body. But in the history of LMU, there has never been

held of, like, top 20 leadership positions at the university. And I remember someone told me that statistically that should be impossible, that, like, it's just the numbers don't really add up so that it's, like, at that point we're,

like, they don't really make it. Yeah. I remember a quote a couple of years ago from Chris Rock when he was talking about Latinos in Hollywood,

and he's like, it's like, "I live in LA. I see you almost purposely have to go out and exclude Latinos for them not to be involved." It's like—

it is clear to me that the procedures and process that we use to hire um, top administrators is biased against Latinos. There is a systematic exclusion of Latino administrators.

It is— really easy to document. We have the data. No Latinos ever.

How does that happen? You know, it can't happen by accident. And people say, "Well—you know—the people who are

on the committees, the administration, we're not racist." And I'm like, "Yeah, you may not individually be racist. You may not be anti-Latino, but the practice you put together, or that you continue to do, even though

they show you that what the results are, you continue to perpetuate them." So for instance, every time we hire a dean. The chair of that dean's search committee has to be

another dean. So there will never be a Latino chairing a search committee by definition. Right?

And so it's just like—and being the chair of that committee is very important in terms of what they could do to lead the discussion, to ask about the criteria, to contextualize the candidates.

I know, because I've been on probably a hundred search committees in my 38 years here, and actually I've been on search committees for other entities sitting on non-profits. I've been on search committees to hire CEOs of some

significant um, uh, non-profits in Los Angeles. And I could tell you being at the table makes a difference. So I've been able to hire Latino CEOs in so-called

non-Latino organizations easier than I have been here at LMU. And so it's incredibly frustrating. I could tell you that if I was the chair of a committee tomorrow, that I could easily hire a

Latino, not because I'm biased, just because I know that there are so many Latinos that are qualified to be president, provost, or deans at this place and to then be able to recruit them, get them to come here,

interview, etcetera. I have no doubt. But it's like, "Oh no, you can't have a bias,

you can't do this." But the whole system is biased, you know? And it's been incredibly frustrating to watch this. Incredible,

nurturing institution, Loyola Marymount University. And how it's been able to nurture Latino students, but is incapable

of understanding and—and not being aware of how it excludes Latinos and so many other aspects. Interesting.